[Accessibility] Two more AT-SPI discussion points

Peter Korn Peter.Korn at Sun.COM
Wed Jun 1 23:40:50 PDT 2005


Hi Bill,

I think locale is reasonably applied to every at-spi object.  It is
already in AccessibleContext in the Java Accessibility API, which is
nice.


Regards,

Peter Korn
Sun Accessibility team

Bill Haneman wrote:
> 
> Hi Olaf:
> 
> Language information does accompany textual information from at-spi, in
> the form of text attribution, at least where it differs from the host
> application's locale.  AccessibleApplication now has a getLocale method
> which can be used to get the locale of the host application.   In almost
> all cases (see below), I think this is the most effective solution.
> 
> At present, I don't know of any applications where textual information
> (labels, names, description, etc.) from widgets that aren't explicitly
> 'Text' widgets doesn't match the application's locale, unless there are
> missing translations.  Without better support in our
> internationalization framework itself, it may not be possible to
> identify these cases reliably; that is, we may not be able to tag text
> as "en_US" or "C" in cases where there is a missing translation.
> 
> I think the cases we know about where multi-locale text occurs by
> design, as opposed to by accident, are 'content' cases.  In this case, I
> believe that the AccessibleText interface will be implemented, and
> therefore lang/locale will be text attributes.
> 
> For some kinds of content this could get interesting - for instance if a
> user views a German web page from a user agent in the en_GB locale, and
> the alt-text for images is only available in German, what do we do
> then?  It may be that in these cases, we need a 'locale' attribute for
> the name/description/image-description properties.  I am not sure
> whether that is reason enough to add this to all AccessibleObjects or
> not - the current model has the advantage that the assistive technology
> does not need to interrogate each object for its locale before
> presenting name or description, so adding this could have disadvantages
> as well.  A reasonable compromise might be to add this information only
> for AccessibleImage, which seems to be the primary use case where a
> "non-textual" content element needs to expose a 'lang' or 'locale'.
> 
> Your second question is interesting; at-spi allows for the 'actual'
> document to be obtained from the StreamableContent interface, in theory,
> possibly in more than one mime-type.  However, because the semantics of
> "document" versus "user agent" are actually not clearly defined
> anywhere, we didn't define such an interface.  In practice, users (both
> sighted and blind, users of assistive technology and otherwise) must
> learn from experience what is "document view" and what is "interface".
> It's relatively easy to figure this out when viewing a static web page,
> but since many documents now include interactive elements, forms, or
> even "fake" popup windows (think about web advertisements!), the
> distinction can get unclear.  One approach to solving this issue is to
> either make the user agent responsible for figuring this out (as in
> self-voicing applications, which is similar I think to what you are
> doing with Konqueror), another is to provide application-specific "read
> everything" scripts in the assistive technoloty (which is the way orca
> handles this).  This may be a use case where an AccessibleDocument
> interface, or at least some kind of tag or attribute on a container
> object, could be useful, in order for a user agent to tell the assistive
> technology "the content view subtree starts here".
> 
> regards
> 
> - Bill
> 
> Olaf Schmidt wrote:
> 
> >Hi!
> >
> >After Cathy's lists seems to have been completely discussed last week,
> >I have two other discussion points about AT-SPI. Both are related to ktts,
> >the speech synthesis framework we have in KDE.
> >
> >ktts can automatically select a correct voice for a given language when
> >reading out a text, so it is important to know which language a text is
> >in. This information is provided by Qt4 Accessibility framework. If I
> >recall correctly, then there are some cases where it is impossible to
> >forward this information to the assisistive technologies when using
> >AT-SPI. We already discussed this at the Unix Accessibility Forum which
> >we hosted during the KDE Conference last summer. Peter and Bill said that
> >AT-SPI could be extended to include language information everywhere. Has
> >this been done in the meantime?
> >
> >My second question is whether AT-SPI allows to get the complete document
> >from an application, and only the document (without other user interface
> >elements). I ask this because ktts allows the user to navigate through
> >longer text that is being read out, using different voices for headings,
> >links, etc. We have integrated this with our web browser, editor and PDF
> >reader. Note that ktts is not meant as a screen reader or as some other
> >assistive technology for accessibng another application. It is a separate
> >application useful for partially sighted people and offers its own user
> >interface. Nevertheless, it would be great if it could benefit from
> >AT-SPI.
> >
> >Olaf
> >
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
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> >Accessibility at mail.freestandards.org
> >http://mail.freestandards.org/mailman/listinfo/accessibility
> >
> >
> 
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