[Accessibility] IRC Log Minutes Draft; A11y Teleconf on March 28

Janina Sajka janina at a11y.org
Wed Apr 4 08:14:31 PDT 2007

A11Y Telecon Log [2007-03-28]

Prepared by Gregory Rosmaita (identified as oedipus below)
Edited by Janina Sajka

Start of #a11y buffer: Wed Mar 28 14:52:47 2007

* Now talking in #a11y
* oedipus was disconnected and am back - can scribe on IRC
* oedipus oedipus' offer to scribe still stands
<oedipus> JS: short items?  CSUN impressions?
<oedipus> JS: extremely impressed at amount of interest and 
  large attendence that have to do with open source / 
  standards / architecture; very well attended; only downside 
  is that was disappointed that one product working in 
  isolation; MythTV TV needs to experience the pain now and move 
  to QT 4.3 beta now to pick up accesssibility support in widget toolkit; 
  something to move forward on - perhaps a sample app that 
  directly supports accessibility; GBH has a lot of experience 
  on media side of things - doing all kinds of tweaks to 
  software without any reality checks; maybe we need an "open 
  dialog" or "open workspace" workshop; will probably have 3 
  presentations for CSUN 2008
<oedipus> JS: anyone else?
* oedipus silence
<oedipus> googleplex accessibility presentation at general 
  session; would we like to hold A11Y face to face during the 
  time of this meeting?  value having accessiblity workshops 
  going on - interaction with others working in open source
<oedipus> JS: discuss on next call next week
<oedipus> Q: accessizer (sp?)
* TGM has joined #a11y
* gk4 has joined #a11y
<TGM> http://live.gnome.org/Accerciser
<oedipus> JS: accessible replacement for at-poke; ability to 
  probe at entire desktop, single app, properties of all 
  widgets, look for problems; tool itself accessible; 
  available from gnome site: live.gnome.org/acceerciser
* oedipus thanks TGM
<TGM> sure
<TGM> who's oedipus?
<oedipus> JS: expect to have RPMs for that as soon as code 
  stable and bugs cleared up - matter of weeks
<gk4> http://live.gnome.org/Accerciser
<TGM> (this is Michael in Chapel Hill, NC)
<oedipus> David: couple of days..
* oedipus oedipus = Gregory Rosmaita (New Jersey)
<TGM> cool
<oedipus> JS: draft mission statement; needs to reflect our 
  changes; 2 more drafts - 1 objection "on behalf of PWD"; 
  making direct statement of why standards being created 
  should be explicitly stated in mission statement; any ideas?
<oedipus> Neil: on behalf of good - shorter the better - whole 
  phrase can go
<oedipus> Olaf: wondering if we should limit this paper to 
  certain groups of disability which we mentioned; do NOT say 
  that this is about disabilities only - some have been 
  addressed, some haven't; lots of disabilities that haven't 
  been addressed; agreement of society whether you call 
  something a disability, a temporary illness, or a different 
  sitation of life; is broader better?  accessibility 
  featutres can benefit everyone (accessibility is usability 
  is accessibility)
<oedipus> JS: can drop "on behalf"
<oedipus> Olaf: add something at end to mention PWD
<oedipus> JS: if you want to suggest something, i'm open to 
  it; other than first sentence, rest is pretty much what 
  we've had for years
<oedipus> JS: other reactions on how to extend?
<oedipus> JS: pull phrase entirely; olaf will submit an ending 
  sentence to point out how accessibility has benefits for 
<oedipus> JS: ISSUE 3: branding
<oedipus> JS: desire to create open accessibility identity 
  beyond scope of linux; always has been an issue that our 
  group's scope is wider than just linux
<oedipus> JS: george - were you going to get a local person to 
  draft some graphics?
<oedipus> George: what do we want in the icon?
<oedipus> JS: lets discuss
<oedipus> JS: concern is that by the time you spell out 
  accessibility, it is too long; concerned about low-vision 
  users - should logo itself have much more than A11Y or Open 
  A11Y - alt text could expand acronym
<oedipus> Gunnar: A11Y not a widely known term
* oedipus general agreement
<oedipus> Gunnar: logo itself should be easily understood
<oedipus> GJR: cascade of logos with final one an SVG icon?
<oedipus> GJR: cascade: SVG, PNG, JPEG - don't have to declare 
  extention for IMG, just name of file, browser picks best fit 
  or user's request
<oedipus> JS: A11Y is a nice short tag
<oedipus> Neil: a large number of people aren't going to get it
<oedipus> ?: A11Y - open source accessibility workgroup; 
<oedipus> GJR: use ACRONYM to contain A11Y expansion
<oedipus> JS: talk with Rich S of IBM; increase visability; 
  Rich and i are meeting with Linux Foundation chair; looking 
  at getting handouts made, identify face2face oportunities
<oedipus> JS: W3C doing a lot of work in this area of open 
  source and distribution across platforms and apps
<oedipus> JS: anything to take to meeting / phone call?
* oedipus no response
<oedipus> George: models have been rearranged; able to drop 
  code before rearrangement; no opportunity to view new 
  structure and code, but seems ok
<oedipus> JS: Gunnar, can we agree on 1900 your time? can earl 
  do a 10 AM?  wondering if we can use this bridge
<oedipus> Gunnar: which?
<oedipus> JS: keyboard I/O spec - earl wants to be a resource, 
  but still limited in time can devote; can get history and 
  context from earl so can transition Gunnar into chairing 
  that group; should be near finalization; main thing is 
  Gunnar's comments and that our doc and test assertions work; 
  short meeting tomorrow
<oedipus> JS: what i'm talking about is very mature 
  alternative keyboard model and spec - StickyKeys, MouseKeys, 
<oedipus> George: submitted libatk tests to LSB last summer; have had 
  a chance to look at it, but couldn't get it to run; 
  programmer just fixed it and resent to LSB this morning; 
  interesting thing about tests is use locked-up mini api in 
  GDK - tests will test ALL portions of the system; want to 
  confirm correct methodology; need help expanding test cases; 
  once establish right methodology, can call for more 
  volunteers to work
<oedipus> JS: want response from LSB that this is good 
  approach, then expand what is being tested, so that we can 
  make a module for LSB
<oedipus> George: hook onto their resources - especially 
<oedipus> JS: don't want to leave it entirely to them - david, 
  will Redhat help?
<oedipus> David: have to ask manager due to other commitments
<oedipus> JS: will ping individuals to test ATK as go forward
<oedipus> George: good way for us to get foot in the door
<oedipus> JS: relatively light-weight, but essential
<oedipus> JS: need to finish "how to structure an LSB doc" - 
  went to list before CSUN - just resent URI to A11Y list
<oedipus> JS: key is getting LibATK module integrated
<oedipus> JS: pete not here - anything to say about 
  IAccessible2 - question concerning eclipse and the GPL 
  license - suspect no problem, but does anyone KNOW?
<oedipus> JS: will take that up when pete available
<oedipus> JS: need to dot the i and cross the t
<oedipus> JS: MathML Handlers - telecon on this topic 
  scheduled for next week on tuesday at 1pm central time - 
  same time as this meeting, just a day earlier - JS will send 
  out reminder - use cases and requirements; interesting news 
  is that we're not the only ones looking for what we've been 
  talking about; unhappiness in W3C about Compound Documents 
  ignore MathML
<oedipus> JS: won't be just math - would generalize quickly 
  into any domain specific markup
<oedipus> what they did for CDF (Compound Document Format) - 
  use OBJECT or EMBED tag, don't deal with how to integrate 
  and interact with documents; MathML WG felt CDF 
  misrepresenting work, and they don't seem to care
<oedipus> JS: in PF we are committed to not letting this issue 
<oedipus> unfortunately, doesn't address our REAL concerns; 
  "these are things we might eventually deal with..." is 
  dangerous verbiage
<oedipus> JS: good news: not just accessibility issue; bad 
  news: AT devs need compound documents earlier; is it an 
  issue for browsers, API, hand-off to third party using 
  standard appropriate ways
<oedipus> JS: beginning to become convinced that naming use 
  cases and environments not all that will be happening in 
  this space
<oedipus> JS: got through list in 40 minutes, rather than an 
  hour and 20!
<oedipus> JS: new items?
<oedipus> JS: getting pinged weekly from NSF about where is your report 
  - have to rewrite portions, funding issues need more 
  concreteness - not just "yeah that's a good idea"
<oedipus> Olaf: intellectual property policy?  software patents 
  need to be dealt with - no word from jim
<oedipus> JS: will ask if anything new and when we can expect 
  things to be moving again when talk with jim on friday
<oedipus> JS: anything else?  last call - ok, let's yield back 
  the balance of our time!
<oedipus> JS: thanks to all
End of #a11y buffer    Wed Mar 28 14:52:47 2007


Janina Sajka,	Phone:	+1.202.595.7777;	sip:janina at a11y.org
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