[Accessibility] minutes: Open A11y Workgroup call 2010-01-05 [draft]

Gregory J. Rosmaita oedipus at hicom.net
Tue Jan 5 12:19:58 PST 2010


minutes from the 5 January 2010 Open Accessibility Workgroup 
teleconference are available as hypertext at:


and as plain text following my signature.  as usual, please report any
errors, mis-attributions, corrections, additions, and clarifications by
replying-to this announcement on-list.

the next Open A11y Workgroup Conference call will be held at 1600h UTC 
on 12 January 2010 - find the meeting time and date in your time zone 
using the following link:


a preliminary agenda for the 12 January 2010 Open A11y Conference call 
can be found at:


thank you, gregory.


Open A11y Workgroup Conference Call (5 January 2010)


     * Janina Sajka (JS/chair)
          + Pete Brunet (PB)
          + Mark Doffman (MD)
          + Mike Gorse (MG)
          + Gregory J. Rosmaita (GJR/scribe)
          + Brad Taylor (BT)
          + Will Walker (WW)
               o regrets: none logged

For Reference

* Agenda for the 5 January 2010 Open A11y Call:

Open Action Items

     * ACTION - GJR: work with Linux Foundation IT team to fix problems
       with new content management system
          + status: in progress; all links off of http://a11y.org/ should
            now lead to the correct destination, and the information
            should be current; systemic problems still being addressed
            with Linux Foundation staff

Announcements & News

AT-SPI2 0.1.4 Available for Download

   AT-SPI2 is a D-Bus based accessibility framework. It defines a D-Bus
   protocol for providing and accessing application accessibility
   information. The project includes a library for bridging the D-Bus
   protocol to the ATK API, allowing Gtk based applications to be made
   accessible. It also contains a client (AT) side library in Python.

   AT-SPI2, version 0.1.4 is available for download at:
     * http://download.gnome.org/sources/pyatspi/0.1/
     * http://download.gnome.org/sources/at-spi2-core/0.1/
     * http://download.gnome.org/sources/at-spi2-atk/0.1/

AT-SPI2 0.1.4 Release Notes

   This is a development release of AT-SPI2, it has some unfinished

   A list of work required before a full release can be found at:


   For more information about the release of AT-SPI2 0.1.4, please


Meeting Minutes

   NOTE: These minutes have not yet been finalized.

Topic 1: AT-SPI on D-Bus Port: Progress and Issues

     * AT-SPI on D-Bus Port wiki page last updated 30 October 2009 by
       Mike Gorse
          + MikeG is maintaining the AT-SPI on D-Bus Port wiki page, and
            will add info about AT-SPI2 development releases to the D-Bus
            wiki page

Discussion of Topic 1: D-Bus Port Update

   WW: had really good hack day a week or so ago -- addressed a lot of
   bugs directly -- driving factor, Orca Regression test to flush out

   WW: MarkD to hack on stuff over holidays - progress with Orca
   Regression test and AT-SPI2

   MD: not yet -- finishing ATK side; next thing is to use Orca for
   regression testing

   WW: leasing large containers -- handle mangagedescendents problem too?

   MD: 2 will go together;

   WW: cool

   WW: collections API?

   MD: MikeG has been working on this; need to test

   MG: running Orca regression tests with FF will help clear up remaining

   WW: structural navigation features of Orca - next heading, next div,
   etc. -- if any failure, involves going back to install; may have Orca
   say "collections broke" when not functioning

   WW: can start hammering away at running regression tests in Orca and
   fixing things as they come up

   WW: scaffolding for CORBA versus D-Bus; buy in from participants; Luke
   Yelavich (hereafter, "LukeY") had question about requirement using
   CORBA -- ok with CORBA as default; will spend time creating patches
   today to make this happen

   WW: Accessibility API on D-Bus?

   MD: need to reply to lee's email -- needs improvement, needs to take
   part in session management; currently have registry doing that, when
   don't need it to -- should be done by a11y d-bus

   WW: need Lee to help on that?

   MD: would be great -- at moment just a script for testing session

   WW: my upcoming plan: relocation; when bus goes away need to connect
   to new one

   MD: working on that -- shouldn't be too big a deal; matter of sending
   correct signals

   WW: shake out bugs with Orca tests, document and fix

   WW: this week: finish implementation and start doing bugs next week

   MD: first release next monday -- after that can attend to smaller

   WW: amazing that are in line with GNOME schedule -- ah, serendipity!

   WW: drop email to Lee on a11y d-bus issues with CC to MarkD

   MD: reconnection of bus; Orca regression tests for collections API

   WW: GNOME panel needs to be investigated; will raise with Lee in email

   BT: use new stuff for panel

   MD: really big change on release, so want to start with subsets before
   merging all

   MG: fine with me; some sample applications that could use - have to
   build with mono, though

   MD: don't mind doing that -- should do today or tomorrow -- aim for
   end of week; complete merge by monday

   WW: MarkD, what about desktop files conditionally shipped with
   makediff package?

   WW: prevented a file from being shipped in distribution -- intent was
   to keep from being installed by default, but not removed from shipped

   MD: will try and work on that

   WW: will be testing makefiles anyway, so can test that, too

   MD: makefiles in pyspi?

   WW: CORBA based ones to do conditional install;

   WW: MD, please look at this -- i think it just needs a change in
   makefile -- make and makeinstall may need revision

   WW: not out of the woods, yet, but have implementations and
   bug-finding and fixing -- just need to sit down and hammer things out

   JS: very encouraging

   JS: being in sync on dot five release is great

   MD: how many to go?

   WW: dot six, then final release within 2 weeks of another -- gnome
   schedule in IRC -- March 16 is hard-code freeze, so need to be done by
   the ides of march

   WW: API changes needed?

   MD: doing work in pyspi

   WW: changes due by January 11 -- providing drop-in replacement; only
   new API is plug-in stuff from Brad and Mike, which is already in

New Business

SpeechDispatcher Update

   JS: Bill Cox coding with LukeY on speech dispatcher on emacs list to
   update support for speechdispatcher and emacspeak -- might finally get
   integrated way to handle Orca, speakup, emacspeak for users who want
   to use a combination of them

   WW: push-back from raman?

   JS: no, just no work being done on emacspeak except by raman -
   friendly response

   JS: concerns seem to have evaporated

   WW: lisp libao module for speechdispatcher?

   JS: libao as way of getting speech for particular OS

   WW: have note to look at that on solaris; module optional - can build
   without or with; introduce another layer between speech engine and
   speech output?

   JS: with linux can choose where integrate into rest of audio

   WW: eSpeak -- Ed from DecTalk project gave eSpeak developers some
   ideas -- turn on and enable;

   WW: less harsh sounding; still very computery - sounds like DecTalk or

   GJR: great localization support; personally consider speech quality
   quite robust

   JS: agree -- it is very easy to understand and to customize

   For Reference:
     * eSpeak Project Home Page

     * SourceForge download page for eSpeak


ISO 13.0.66 to 13.0.66-4

For Reference:
 * ISO/IEC JTC 1/SC 35: User interfaces Sub-Committee Home Page

     + area of work: Standardization in the field of user-system
       interfaces in information and communication technology (ICT)
       environments and support for these interfaces to serve all
       users, including people having accessibility or other
       specific needs, with a priority of meeting the JTC 1
       requirements for cultural and linguistic adaptability.

     + JTC 1/SC 35: User Interfaces ISO Technical Committee Catalog page

 * ISO/IEC CD 13066-1: Information Technology - Interoperability with
   Assistive Technology (AT) -- Part 1: Requirements and
   recommendations for interoperability

   JS: document spec in ISO specification 13.0.66 about assistive
   technologies; produced in special working group on a11y with which we
   have worked; sub-committee of committee on

   JS: APIs on key operating systems - description of a11y interfaces on
   linux; Peter Korn (hereafter, "PeterK") in last meeting promised to
   follow up -- sent email to him to suggest he do it under a11y.org

   JS: will expect some help in making sure that what i write is correct

   JS: need to find out what they expect and what format is best

   JS: sub-committee meeting in Madrid after which work will get serious
   on getting document done

   PB: include IA2?

   JS: IBM is covering that in windows spec - Andi doing that write-up

   PB: dates? different versions of spec; have some documentation changes
   to put in, but can port

   JS: current 13.0.66 working on 13.0.66-4

   WW: PeterK on vacation until next week


LSB certification

For Reference:
* Linux Standard Base (LSB):

   JS: once comfortable with D-Bus implementations, can go back to LSB
   and say "lets move the a11y support into what LSB certification tests

   JS: not comfortable with CORBA plus D-Bus, but when totally D-Bus, can
   be part of LSB

   WW: require C-bindings for these?

   JS: don't recall offhand

   JS: machine testability also LSB concern

   WW: we are machine testable through python and C-code, but need C-code
   bindings for D-Bus

   WW: need to figure out whether should move forward with it at what
   stage and time; please check the following link: info on 2 point 29 is
   available from GNOME:


   JS: will re-grok LSB certification requirements


Licensing Issues (Redux)

   JS: PB, i will push licensing issues with KarenC and JimZ of Linux
   Foundation; have all permissions we need; no reason why can't get
   top-level link to IA2 from Linux Foundation front page and in
   LF news, etc.


Identify Topics for the 12 January 2010 Teleconferences

     * D-Bus Port: Progress & Updates
     * Getting Open Accessibility Documents to ISO Status
     * Collaborative Work with JTC 1/SC 35: User interfaces Sub-Committee


Wrap Up

     * meeting adjourned 1644h UTC
     * next Open A11y conference call: 2010-01-12

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