[bitcoin-dev] BIP 174 thoughts
jan.matejek at satoshilabs.com
Thu Jun 21 11:29:44 UTC 2018
On 19.6.2018 19:16, Pieter Wuille wrote:
>> 1) Why isn't the global type 0x03 (BIP-32 path) per-input? How do we
>> know, which BIP-32 path goes to which input? The only idea that comes to
>> my mind is that we should match the input's scriptPubKey's pubkey to
>> this 0x03's key (the public key).
>> If our understanding is correct, the BIP-32 path is global to save space
>> in case two inputs share the same BIP-32 path? How often does that
>> happen? And in case it does, doesn't it mean an address reuse which is
> Yes, the reason is address reuse. It may be discouraged, but it still
> happens in practice (and unfortunately it's very hard to prevent
> people from sending to the same address twice).
> It's certainly possible to make them per-input (and even per-output as
> suggested below), but I don't think it gains you much. At least when a
> signer supports any kind of multisig, it needs to match up public keys
> with derivation paths. If several can be provided, looking them up
> from a global table or a per-input table shouldn't fundamentally
> change anything.
So here’s a thing I’m still confused about.
Imagine two cases, for a naive Signer:
- either all data is global
- or most data is per input.
Now, the general signing flow is this:
1. Pre-serialize the transaction
2. Prepare the current input - fill out scriptPubKey (or equivalent for
3. find a secret key
4. output public key + signature
Step (3) is the main issue here.
In the case of everything per-input, the naive Signer can do this:
1. (in the global section) pre-serialize the transaction
2. (in each input) find and fill out scriptPubKey from the provided UTXO
3. (for a given BIP32 path) check if the master fingerprint matches
mine, if yes, derive secret key, output pubkey, signature
4. goto 3 (more keys per input), goto 2 (next input)
Note that this flow works perfectly for multisig; it’s going to be the
job of a Finalizer to build the final scriptSig, but each input can have
multiple partial signatures -- and, interestingly, the naive Signer
doesn’t even need to know about multisig.
A less naive Signer will want to check things, maybe derive a scriptSig
itself and check if it matches the given hash, etc., but it can do this
all in place. You go linearly through the signing flow and place a
couple strategic assertions along the way.
However, if the data is global, as is now, it gets more complicated:
1. (in the global section) pre-serialize the transaction, prefill lookup
2. (for a given BIP32 path) check if mine, then derive public key and
store in a dictionary
3. (for each input) find _and parse_ scriptPubKey, extract (PK or)
4. lookup redeem script based on script-hash; if not found, goto 2; if
found, parse out public key
5. lookup public key in the BIP32 dictionary; if not found, goto 2
6. output pubkey, signature
In addition to being more steps and lookups, it requires the Signer to
understand the redeem script. A strict Signer will want that anyway, but
in the first case, the Signer can regenerate the scripts and compare
specificaly the ones it's working with; here, you need to parse them
even before you know what you're comparing to.
Is there something I’m missing? Because as I see it, there is literally
no advantage to the more complicated flow; that’s why we assumed that
the format is space-saving, because saving space was the only reason we
> If we go down this route, if a field is marked as mandatory, can you
> still act as a combiner for it? Future extensions should always
> maintain the invariant that a simple combiner which just merges all
> the fields and deduplicates should always be correct, I think. So such
> a mandatory field should only apply to signers?
> However, perhaps we do want to enforce at-most one UTXO per input. If
> there are more potential extensions like this, perhaps a key-value
> model is better, as it's much easier to enforce no duplicate keys than
> it is to add field-specific logic to combiners (especially for
> extensions they don't know about yet).
In general, you seem to focus a lot on the role of Combiners, esp.
simple Combiners. To me, that doesn’t look like a significant role. As I
envision it, a Combiner really doesn’t need to do anything more
complicated than merge and deduplicate records, simply based on the
uniqueness of the whole record.
It’s the Finalizer’s job to reconstruct and validate the result. Also
ISTM if something messes up the PSBT (such as including multiple
conflicting fields anywhere), it’s OK to leave it to Finalizer to fail.
Are the Combiners supposed to be separate from Finalizers? (Is there a
risk of a Combiner passing along a bad PSBT, Finalizer rejecting it, and
the other parties not finding out?)
> If we go with the "not put signatures/witnesses inside the transaction
> until all of them are finalized" suggestion, perhaps the number of
> inputs field can be dropped. There would be always one exactly for
> each input (but some may have the "final script/witness" field and
> others won't).
Strongly agree with this. A guarantee that number of inputs in the
transaction corresponds to number of input fields for PBST looks cleaner
than specifying it separately. This way we can also drop the "input index".
> Right now, the BIP32 fields are of the form <master
> Instead, I suggest fields of the form <master pubkey><master
> The fingerprint in this case is identical to the first 32 bit of the
> Hash160 of <master pubkey>, so certainly no information is lost by
> making this change.
> This may be advantageous for three reasons:
> * It permits signers to have ~thousands of master keys (at which point
> 32-bit fingerprints would start having reasonable chance for
> collisions, meaning multiple derivation attempts would be needed to
> figure out which one to use).
> * It permits signers to index their master keys by whatever they like
> (for example, SHA256 rather than Hash160 or prefix thereof)> * It permits signers who don't store a chaincode at all, and just
> protect a single private key.
I like this last usecase a lot, but perhaps that's a role for a
"sub-Creator"? see below.
Also, is there a reason to publish the chain code, wouldn't just the
public key be sufficient to accomplish all three usecases you list?
I sort of dislike the notion that you need to give all this information
to a possibly untrusted Creator.
An aside to this in particular, I’ve been thinking about the requirement
to share derivation paths and public keys with the Creator. The spec
assumes that this will happen; you’re talking about providing full
xpub+chaincode too. At least, the Creator must prefill BIP32 paths and
master key fingerprints. Possibly also prefill public keys in the redeem
This might not be an improvement proposal, but a point worth being
raised and maybe explained in the spec. Perhaps the original Creator
doesn’t have access to this data, and delegates this to some
“sub-Creators” - I imagine a coordinator sending a PSBT to signing
parties, each of which acts as a sub-Creator (fills out derivation paths
and public keys) and a Signer (forwarding to a HWW). Some of the
discussion even suggests some sort of generic “key derivation field”
with arbitrary contents - fingerprint + bip32 path? xpub + chain code?
derivation points? encrypted xprv?
thank you for your comments
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Size: 819 bytes
Desc: OpenPGP digital signature
More information about the bitcoin-dev