[Bitcoin-segwit2x] Strong 2-Way Replay Protection

bitPico bitpico at icloud.com
Wed Oct 11 23:30:44 UTC 2017


This mailing list is for discussion of the SegWit2x Bitcoin upgrade; more specifically upgrading from deprecated code (1x) to upgraded code (2x) to increase the base block size.

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> On Oct 9, 2017, at 3:51 PM, Marcel Jamin via Bitcoin-segwit2x <bitcoin-segwit2x at lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
> 
> On 9 October 2017 at 19:00, Mike Belshe <mike at bitgo.com <mailto:mike at bitgo.com>> wrote:
> 
>> I was using Bitcoin Core's expectation of 60% maximum increase as described
>> here:
>> https://bitcoincore.org/en/2016/01/26/segwit-benefits/#block-capacitysize-increase <https://bitcoincore.org/en/2016/01/26/segwit-benefits/#block-capacitysize-increase>
>> 
> 
> (The lower bound of it.)
> 
>> Nobody is debating Schnorr signatures here.  I think that is a great idea
>> for the future too.
> 
> I brought up Schnorr signatures and LN up as examples of thinking
> about growing capacity.
> 
>> You failed to articulate any technical arguments here.
> 
> I didn't try to. Those have already been made by people far more
> capable than me again and again. And subsequently handwaved away. Talk
> about being insulting.
> 
>>> The sheer audacity of non-tech people to promote their technical
>>> solution despite overwhelming expert opposition is mind-boggling
>>> (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Segwit_support <https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Segwit_support>). I'm sorry to be blunt,
>>> but you're way out of your circle of competence and you need to
>>> recognize that.
>> 
>> 
>> Okay, thanks for the insults.  I suggest you do some research.
> 
> Your behaviour is insulting as well. Almost as if you didn't do
> research on the numerous people whose assessments you are continually
> dismissing.
> 
> Swap "non-tech" for "bitcoin non-experts", if you like. It's
> admittedly more accurate. My point remains the same.
> 
>>>> I've never heard customers say "no thanks" to better scalability except
>>>> in Bitcoin.
>>> 
>>> Bitcoin is not a business and does not have customers. It has users,
>>> many of which don't primarily value it because of super low
>>> transactions fees, but because of it's censorship resistance. Because
>>> of the fact that no single entity or group has full control over it.
>>> This includes DCG & friends.
>> 
>> 
>> I've never heard users say "no thanks" to better scalability except in
>> Bitcoin.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Changes to bitcoin must be argued for. All concerns need to be
>>> addressed. If we start making backroom deals to get stuff in and let
>>> certain groups hold things like SegWit hostage to successfully get
>>> what they want but can't properly argue for, I'd consider this
>>> experiment failed.
>> 
>> 
>> You have failed to make any technical arguments here. This has all been
>> done, and after fervent debate, the decisions have been made.
> 
> Looks like I didn't get the memo.
> 
>> At this point, the onus is on you to provide technical arguments against
>> segwit2x. While you have provided a full course dinner of insults to me and
>> everyone else here, you've failed to state even one single technical
>> argument against segwit2x.
> 
> If telling it how it is insults you, you may want to reevaluate your position.
> 
> But I'll stop here. I acknowledge that the "Why?" is considered
> off-topic here. I also agree that my hostile stance towards what I
> perceive as an attack isn't really helping here. My apologies.
> 
> This will sort itself out in the coming weeks anyway.
> 
>>>> Today, Bitcoin is small potatoes.  Want to make it really soar?  Make it
>>>> available to everyone.
>>> 
>>> We owe it to ourselves to do it properly.
>> 
>> 
>> Again, give me a technical argument.
>> 
>> 
>> Mike
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