[lsb-discuss] LSB conf call notes for 2008-03-19

Jeff Licquia jeff at licquia.org
Wed Mar 19 09:13:08 PDT 2008

Attendees: Sam, Jeff, Ted, Stew, Dan, Marvin, Alexey, Robert.

Jeff: Low attendance.  Sam: may be because of the conf call bridge; 
should check.  Jeff observes that a few people are joining w/o the call 
getting notification.

SI.  Marvin was able to get builds on devel working on all archs except 
ppc64.  Sam's fixes so far haven't caused any problems.  Now need to add 
the rest of the 3.2 stuff.  Sam: no list, is working on one.  Ted: 
ProjectPlan32.  Alexey: can use the Navigator for that as well.  Jeff: 
Marvin's time?  Marvin: will work on it this week w/o official support; 
if it takes more than a week, will revisit.

Jeff: 4.0 SI, domu set up.  Ted: power?  Marvin: pretty beefy, but the 
more we put on it, the more loaded it gets.  Ted: check with Antonio. 
Thinking about getting a 4-way x86_64 box for this sort of thing, still 
working on newer Power box.  Markus looking to get a bigger ia64 box.

Tools.  Jeff: what does it mean to improve our tools?  What tasks do 
these involve?   Ted: sent an email to ISPRAS, should send to the list. 
  Packaging: packaging the chroot SI w/ packages, such that one could 
easily launch the SI via a icon, via ssh to a special sshd, or 
something.  Make lsbcc work in a slightly more relaxed mode for 
generating an app that ran on multiple distros.  Improve ATK Manager; 
Cal can look at filling in the notes.  What additional things could we 
do for the tools?  Robert: see presentation I gave at F2F.  Two areas: 
building an LSB compliant app, and testing it.  Building: automation. 
Must make it as easy to automate as possible.  What are the requirements 
from an IT perspective of setting that up?  SI that "just runs" would be 
nirvana.  Second best: install these packages, and that will give you a 
devel system.  Chroot not easy.  Ted: idea not just chroot, but ways to 
use the chroot that are easy, beyond just "chroot to here".  Bind mounts 
to home dirs, etc.  Robert: depends on the setup.  Ted: what setups have 
you used?  Robert: triggers in version control are popular.  That's 
where the chroot hooks would have to work.  Ted: command-line way to 
launch the chroot and start the build is what you mean?  Robert: yes. 
Multiple ways to get in are good; ssh would be useful too.  Developer on 
desktop is not the only use case to think about.  Back-end build server 
is also a very important tool.  Ted: what tools do we need in the build 
env besides the base SI plus the LSB tools plus a compiler?  (awk, sed, 
etc.)  Robert: easy way to install the chroot, add tools (scons, ant, 
etc.), and build is what we need.  Ted: need to think; some stuff may 
not be LSB-compliant.  Should think about what tools we provide by 
default.  Robert: yes, it's hard to figure out, may be hard to do.  Ted: 
incremental approach, start with 1.0 and iterate.  Robert: lsbcc should 
produce results the developer can depend on; results with lsbcc should 
match results with SI/buildenv build.  Ted: maybe the buildenv is the 
only supported way to do builds; is that useful?  Is the buildenv too 
much?  Robert: resources not an issue.

Ted: ATK?  Robert: got an email from Alexey; request to test the latest 
ATK, not gotten to it yet.  Wants to point ATK to the entry point for 
the app, press "go", get a complete report.  Alexey: we believe the 
current ATK Manager should do this.  Experimental ATK Manager available 
that does not require root access to install/use.  Two reports: journal 
analysis, dependency report; working on better presentation of this 
information.  Welcome any ideas.  Robert: did you send me the 
experimental version or the public version?  Alexey: sent released 
version; experimental version available from the wiki.  Robert: send me 
experimental stuff, will test as time constraints allow, will try to 
turn around within a week.

Ted: dynamic linker proposal.  Jeff: quick summary.  Robert: how?  Ted: 
at early stage of executable (crti.o, init section), code fragment that 
checks for ld-lsb.so and if it's a symlink.  If ld-lsb is different from 
standard dynamic linker, re-exec with the LSB interpreter.  Robert: ISVs 
need to be able to support customers; don't have the ability to dictate. 
  Ted: Enabling building image on multiple distros is a key feature for 
mid-tier ISVs.  Robert: reasonable to check at install time for LSB. 
Relaxed mode may not be necessary.  Jeff: relaxed mode vs. dynamic 
linker?  Ted: relaxed mode means relaxed attitude regarding standard 
libs.  Robert: linker thing is a definite win, may not be necessary in 
the long run.  Network installs may have an issue with ensuring a LSB 

Ted: received only a few bugzilla ballots; can we get those in by the 
end of the week?

Ted: will visit Indianapolis on 27th; should set up a meeting.

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